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It shouldn’t really surprise anyone that the school, whose students manage to build cars overnight inside off-limits campus structures, has a team working on an EV that rivals the Roadster. And this one can charge in ten minutes.
The team is retrofitting a 2010 Mercury Milan hybrid with an electric engine built for a bus. Their EV will have a top speed of 100 mph, will crank out 12,000 RPM, and - using a mere 7,905 lithium ion batteries – can drive 200 miles on a single, 350 kwh charge.
The bad news is, 7,905 batteries are expensive – the MIT team spent $80,000 on their battery pack alone. Also, 350 kwh is a humongous amount of charge; you don’t get that from your outlet, you need special chargers for that. A lot of EV batteries might be able to charge that quickly if they were hooked up to a mega-sized charger like that.
The good news is that this car isn’t bad for a group of inexperienced students’ first try. GM, and all the other car companies who want to build EVs for real should take note, and make sure to hire the best and brightest engineers. Maybe they should just hire these guys.
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written by Lou Grinzo, July 28, 2009
It's not a 350 kW-HOUR pack, it takes 350 kW to recharge it! (Check the source page this article links to.) If the car went only 200 miles on a 350 kWh charge (about one tenth the miles/kWh one would expect), at 10 cents/kWh it would cost over 17 cents/mile just for the electrons.
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written by TB, July 28, 2009
That's not the first time ecogeek has confused kW and kWh.
This is basic physics, guys. The watt (W) is a rate of energy transfer, one joule per second. A watt-hour (Wh) is the quantity of energy which would flow during one hour at the constant rate of one watt. Convert hours to seconds and multiply, you get 1Wh = 3600J.
When talking about electric cars, kW is describing how quickly energy can get into or out of the batteries while kWh is describing how much energy can be stored in total.
This is basic physics, guys. The watt (W) is a rate of energy transfer, one joule per second. A watt-hour (Wh) is the quantity of energy which would flow during one hour at the constant rate of one watt. Convert hours to seconds and multiply, you get 1Wh = 3600J.
When talking about electric cars, kW is describing how quickly energy can get into or out of the batteries while kWh is describing how much energy can be stored in total.
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written by cbd, July 29, 2009
There are alot of great things going on in the world of e-mobility.
In order to see that it stays that way, communications should be credible.
I hope someone does a quick math reality check here soon.
In order to see that it stays that way, communications should be credible.
I hope someone does a quick math reality check here soon.
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written by Bouke timbermont, July 29, 2009
"GM, and all the other car companies who want to build EVs for real should take note, and make sure to hire the best and brightest engineers."
Why doesn't Gm just rehire the EV1 team they sacked in 2003?
Just thinking about the EV1-genocide GM did makes me angry again
Why doesn't Gm just rehire the EV1 team they sacked in 2003?
Just thinking about the EV1-genocide GM did makes me angry again
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written by hyperspaced, July 29, 2009
W = Power (rate of energy)
Wh = Energy
350KWh charge in 10 minutes --> requires more than 2MW power supply.
If the power supply is 100% efficient (impossible) and operates at European household voltages a.k.a. 220V then it would require a 9000 Amp cable (the size of a tree trunk).
If it operates at 2400V voltage then it would require an 800+ Amp cable.
Good luck.
Wh = Energy
350KWh charge in 10 minutes --> requires more than 2MW power supply.
If the power supply is 100% efficient (impossible) and operates at European household voltages a.k.a. 220V then it would require a 9000 Amp cable (the size of a tree trunk).
If it operates at 2400V voltage then it would require an 800+ Amp cable.
Good luck.
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written by Akos3D, July 29, 2009
Well, I got confused here (and don't even mention the problems with US people loving e-car story way over its importance...)
First the article tells us that MIT guys (pre-engineers) have used up 80k$ for putting battery bank into a car, that charges in ten minutes. Then it says the charger also would cost a fortune (not to mention conversion costs).
This makes a super inefficient and financially super irrelevant try from these students.
Then asks for GM and others to higher these "best and brightest engineers" for designing future EV cars.
I just hope GM and others DO NOT employ THESE guys.
First the article tells us that MIT guys (pre-engineers) have used up 80k$ for putting battery bank into a car, that charges in ten minutes. Then it says the charger also would cost a fortune (not to mention conversion costs).
This makes a super inefficient and financially super irrelevant try from these students.
Then asks for GM and others to higher these "best and brightest engineers" for designing future EV cars.
I just hope GM and others DO NOT employ THESE guys.
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written by Bob Wallace, July 29, 2009
Well, I'm not writing you a letter of recommendation to the economics department....
Prototype prices have little to do with the price of something once it goes into mass production.
Even early release prices don't foretell where prices will stabilize. Remember, the first simple electronic calculator sold for about $700 in 'back then' dollars. Now they sell for, well, about nothing....
Prototype prices have little to do with the price of something once it goes into mass production.
Even early release prices don't foretell where prices will stabilize. Remember, the first simple electronic calculator sold for about $700 in 'back then' dollars. Now they sell for, well, about nothing....
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written by Akos3D, July 30, 2009
Bob!
Batteries and chargers are already in super mass-production. They used Lithium based batteries, 7,905 pieces of them, right from your mobile phone's spare part catalogue.
Batteries and chargers are already in super mass-production. They used Lithium based batteries, 7,905 pieces of them, right from your mobile phone's spare part catalogue.
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written by Bob Wallace, July 30, 2009
Akos -
And the cost of hand wiring 7,905 of them together?
This is a prototype. One cannot make any predictions of future price based on a prototype. Yes, they used some off the shelf parts, but they had to assemble them in a non-standard manner.
Did you pay attention to what it cost to manufacture each GM EV1?
And the cost of hand wiring 7,905 of them together?
This is a prototype. One cannot make any predictions of future price based on a prototype. Yes, they used some off the shelf parts, but they had to assemble them in a non-standard manner.
Did you pay attention to what it cost to manufacture each GM EV1?
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written by Bob Wallace, July 30, 2009
Well, in the previous post we see an example of Bob's brain pre-coffee.
The MIT car's $80k battery price obviously didn't come from the "cost of hand wiring" as lab rats come free.
The cost comes because a product meant for use was adapted for another. It says nothing about what it would cost to make batteries for a similar car were they to be designed for the purpose and manufactured large scale.
The MIT car's $80k battery price obviously didn't come from the "cost of hand wiring" as lab rats come free.
The cost comes because a product meant for use was adapted for another. It says nothing about what it would cost to make batteries for a similar car were they to be designed for the purpose and manufactured large scale.
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written by Kimi, August 06, 2009
10 minutes? Really? I don't charge my 24V, 4.5A laptop in 10 minutes right now.
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written by Einstein, August 06, 2009
Batteries have internal resistence which creates heat when charged and/or discharged (impedance). They are like a slow burning fuse. The faster you charge/discharge them the faster they burn out. Yes you can charge a Li-ion battery in 10 minutes. Do that enough and you shorten its life very significantly.
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Is the $80k due to an economy of scale issue? Would the price drastically fall were these batteries to be build in huge numbers?
Or are these batteries built out of non-obtainium?