MAY 12

I think the idea of buildings generating their own power is good but not that of a spinning tower. Why, you may ask.

It is because after about 20 years or so, the gears wear out, even if the rotation is slow. Energy could be produced without the tower spinning.

adrianakau@aol.com

why does it have to spin?

It totally doesn't have to spin...and, in fact, It'd be more sustainable if it didn't. But the new platter-based design makes the turbines and the spinning floors possible, and in Dubai, where peculiarity reigns supreme, a spinning tower is, for some reason, highly coveted. And, as long as it powers itself, I really can't complain.

Surely a severe mechanical failure that jammed several floors together, would cause the the tower to rip itself to pieces. As it would be just like stopping a giant flywheel.

There is also the problem of internal access to the floors, if they all rotate independently, any sort of lift system would be horrendously complicated.

Evacuation would be virtually impossible, in the event of a fire, if the power failed.

I'm not briefed on the specifics here, Rob. But I do know that the concrete core of the building contains the elevators, fire stairs as well as a lobby for each floor (from which you access the floors.)

I think jamming gears definitely wouldn't tear the building apart, a fast spin would be one revolution per hour. Enough for a little jolt, I'm sure, but nothing to destroy the building.

Anyhow...those are details I'll leave to the engineers...if they really are going to build one in Dubai, then they're certainly going to be able to figure that stuff out.

http://tinyurl.com/2m66ox
The above link to the James K. polk Building in Nashville, TN has a central concrete core..Taylor and Crabtree Design and built in 1981 to house State Offices, TN Performing Arts Centre and TN State Museum.

The floors are anchored togther. A series of tornados on April 16, 1998 did a lot of damage to the building and occupants during the storm stated the the floors moved up and down. Also, there is always a concern weight too far out away from the central support.

This would be different since the cantilever of the Polk Building is at the top and supports all the floors where a cantilever system would independently support all floors in teh Dubai or Chicago structures.

Elevators are not so bad as they would be in the central core of the building. At least that is how they work at the Polk building .. and it was built without Dubai $$ -- Lowest Bidder TN State Project Go Figure.

Somebody did a lot of math!

I'm doubtful about how much energy you can actually get out of this thing. I haven't studied wind power aerodynamics, but have they considered how wide the gaps for the turbines will have to be to actually get a good airflow passing through? Also, the pictures show the building coming out of the ocean, but is this actually the plan? If it's built in the middle of a city, how much wind will the lower stories actually get? I'm not saying it won't work, but I'm pretty skeptical.

Links to more power producing skyscrapers:

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2007/03/bahrain_install.php

http://www.gearlog.com/2007/04/the_green_skyscraper.php

Evacuation would be virtually impossible, in the event of a fire, if the power failed.

If the power failed, the building should stop turning, right? Regardless, a central spiral staircase (around the elevator shaft, maybe) with a ring platform at each floor would make it easy to evacuate if the floors weren't moving, no matter where they stopped. And if they were moving, all you have to achieve is stepping over the slowly moving threshold between stairs and platform.

I think the biggest problem will be ensuring that this building will last longer than a few decades, anything moving will be worn out eventually.

and why do they have to move individually?

I was just wondering how many headeches someone workign there will ahve

One staircase in the middle would be a 'traffic-jam' when you get to the lower levels... and what happens if the problem is in the center core?? how is everyone to escape then?

wouldn't people get motion sickness?
How would they cook food?
Maybe it is kind of like when you are on a boat?

LOL.. No it is a good idea to have a circular tower instead of a square tower, less resistants.

whats the point of having built in turbines? if you could just make a tower that spins without the turbines between each floor, the spinning of the tower could spin a generator, thus producing electricity, it most likely can't produce much since people don't do that, but I feel like such a large building would be able to generate a shit ton of electricity just by using its own spin

Are you sure this wasn't published in the Onion's Architecture Section?

Motion sickness in tall buildings is a known problem and now we're going to twirl people around in addition to having them sway back and forth?

Wind (and solar) power on a skyscraper is a good goal, and it's fine to dream. But moving floors are a waste of energy, all that fixed glass is a waste of energy, and the airspaces between each floor increases the floors and ceilings to be insulated 50-fold (assuming 50 stories).

The actual power generating mechanisms, between the floors, "need work". Lots of work. There is a reason the most successful form of wind turbine tends to be upright and propeller-shaped.

The single greatest energy users in a modern skyscraper are the lights which provide illumination and the air conditioners which cool the building down. Even in northern cities, the air conditioners are running all year long.

What would be truly revolutionary would be a modern skyscraper which takes advantage of natural light and ventilation, and encourages it's occupants to take the stairs.

If the tower generated its own energy wouldn't that greatly reduce if not eliminate the possibility of electrical outages unless in the case of a mechanical failure, especially if each floor generated its own power. The possibility then is that one floor out of 50 may be without power, which is better than an entire building.

The Empire Puke Building!

Is this guy an idiot

Although great in concept.....
I would hate to be on the ground floor sidewalk when the building comes whirling around to hit me.... Lock down the first 5-10 floors in the animation Also, it's 5-10 floors for the people who don't like to spin while they live and work LOL.

Aha! So THATS what they do will all of our gas money!!

once again they put their oil wealth to building revolutionary structures. they are a great test bed of futuristic construction technology for the rest of the world.

and dubai, if you're reading this...got grancrete?

If you had an office or condo on one side spinning would give you all the views. Just my thought. I like the spinning.

It looks cool, but where will the anti-sway dampener be located ? At the top ?

Buildings obviously have a tendancy to sway and every new building has some type of system installed at the top floors to counter this sway.

If this dampening system is not done correctly, the floors will possibly hit each other at the corners/edges as the building sways.

Maybe the gap between floors/turbines is several inches ?

I think this is a pretty unique idea. Granted, it's unorthodox, maybe thats why some people seem to think it's a horrible idea.

However ... instead of criticising ... I'd like to see you come up with a revolutionary idea of your own. These people are professionals! They know what they're doing. geez.

Its not your design. If the tower is funded and its operational, then leave it alone. Design your own sky scraper and stop complaining.

I think this is a far-fetched idea, not just unorthodox. the chance of this becoming a reality is slim. moving skyscrapers will pose huge problems for the people living in it and around it. i think it is just too far-fetched to be anything but a concept.

and just think about this, the next time someone slams a plane into the tower, it can just spin itself round and round !!

i didnt know you guys were millionaire engineers with advanced engineering degrees like the guys who came up with this WHICH is being built.

to everyone claiming this isnt going to work, just shut the fuck up... please... shut...the...fuck...up.

Maybe it's my futurist nature, but I see this as having the glass half full.

Lets come up with some solutions to the obvious shortcomings.

-Anti-Sway Mechanism
It's true... buildings, tall ones, sway a lot in the wind. Giant weights aid inertia to stabilize tall buildings. The top floor or two could be giant tanks storing water, which is one of the best dampening methods available. The tanks also serve the entire building with drinking water as well as for dozens of buildings nearby.

Motion Sickness
Lets assume we solve the taditional sway issues above. The next motion we have to worry about is rotary. Well, this would be slow to begin with. As someone said, maybe a rotation an hour. The top speed would be capped mechanically as to prevent noticably intense bursts of motion.

oops, sorry I accidentally hit post before I was done.

...motion sickness (cont)
So lets assume they would never allow rotary speed to become so great it is uncomfortable.

-How could wind move a building?
Well, skyscrapers have huge amounts of wind on their faces, especially at the higher levels. This is partly do to the funneling of wind that occurs. The drafts are not just horizontal, but there is a nearly continuous draft moving vertical along the face. If designed properly, the building would use this to create a slow corkscrew motion in addition to the horizontal bursts. It would be slow, but enough to make power.

-What if the power fails? Emergencies?
Much like a ski chairlift, the rotation would cease if the power went out. Mechanical clamps held open by electricity, so when the elctricity fails or some other emergency ensues, the power to the clamps would be cut, thus forcing them closed (think mousetrap held open by an electric motor) In the event of a crippling emergency (explosion, fire, etc) I could envision a trap-door in every floor/ceiling, much like the staircase from an attic that unfolds, but with large steps. Put a dozen of these on each floor/ceiling, and escape routes are preserved & maximized. The floors might be out of alignment, but stagger the ceiling trap doors so you cold drop out like 2 or 3 at a given location to make room for the escape stairs. This would be the trickiest part, as it would have to be designed to not use electricity and get through pressurized lubricant/insulation in between floors (see insulation below)

-Parts wearing out from motion?
The design must incorporate serviceability to the generator cores. Think of this like the generators on a dam. We have dams that are decades old which still contain the original turbines. The parts would be serviced in much the same manner in the building. The service core shaft allows access to wedges of parts that are replaced/maintained regularly. The power to the rotation clamps is removed (see power failure above) and the floor stops rotating for service.

-Elevators? Stairs?
The main stairs would circle the central core like a wrapped around the core like a DNA helix. 4 or 8 main stairwells could be staggered slightly to offer multiple access points. Coupled with escape hatch/ladders (see above), this could perhaps provide ample stair access, even in emergencies. Elevators are in a circular arrangement in the central core. 4 or 8 elevators total. Stepping out to the floor from an elevator or staircase would not be like stepping off a merry go round in motion. The motion would barely be visible to the naked eye it would be moving so slow.

Insulation between floors?
I see opportunity here for a liquid lubricant that is also a good insulator. Something like shaving cream mode from silicone.

There;s still some flaw with my solutions, but I did this in 30 minutes after reading the article. Imagine what hundreds of highly-skilled and motivated architects and engineers could do in several years time.

Finally, to my title... 'they said the same thing about the light bulb'. There will always be pessimists who say it can't be done. Think about what others said of man flying, crating a personal computer, manned space exploration, nuclear power, or any other of countless amount of ground-breaking ideas that have come to fruition. No matter what, people that say it can't be done merely inspire people like myself who say it can. Although, with this concept... they might have bitten off a bit more than they can chew. =)

How fast do some of you people think this building would spin? The turbines would spin faster, but the floors themselves would only rotate once an hour.

To give you an idea how many headaches this would create, take a minute out of your busy schedules and rotate yourself six degrees to one direction... that would be if you're leaning against an elevator.

But lets get math-geekfor a second here...
Even if the building were an impossible 1000 feet wide, at one revolution per hour the fastest you'd be traveling is about 3142 ft/hr. That works out to about 0.6 miles per hour (almost 1 kilometer per hour.) If you don't get motion sickness from walking slowly, then I think we can assume you're safe here. No food flying out of the frying pan, no 'brown outs' for the massive G-forces, and obviously after this post, no woman waiting for me when I log off

^bwuhahahaah nice one.

He must be a descendent of the Rubix family.

They are building it in Dubai. Let's watch and see if it works.

Spinning turbines between floors: I'll bite. Sounds interesting, allows turbines at various heights to spin as fast as their own wind will allow rather than creating a huge sail on top of the building.

Spinning floors: total waste of mechanical energy that could be used to spin the turbines faster and generate more electricity, and with serious design and safety issues. At best, maybe spin the outer ring of a circular building--i.e., the offices/rooms with the actual view of the windows move, and the remainder of the floor is stationary, providing ample architectural stability and room for fire escapes, etc.

Well, what you call "Wasted mechanical energy," a lot of others are calling "really really cool enough to go to Dubai and see this thing in person." They're not trying to build a 'green' building here, just another example of the insane level of extravagance they're hoping to exhibit. Look into "Palm Island." Building that was wasted mechanical energy too. But if it brings in the tourists, and gives them bragging rights, then it's worth it to them.

What's going to be interesting about this is that when it's built (and yes, I do think it looks like it can be done, albeit not with the huge power return they're claiming,) the worst enemy is going to be sand. Unless they have some very clever ways of blocking it, it's going to cause some major problems. If they can build it there, I'm guessing they can build one anywhere though.

I agree, the floors are spinning just for kicks...could the building not generate enough energy by just having intermediate spinning elements between floors to generate power, to take advantage of the huge wind loads as you increase in height?

I meant, just keep the turbines in the original idea between floors and eliminate the rotating floors.

Actually what I was thinking about was a tower made from just the turbines with small platforms separating each one. Put something like that near a windy area and you create massive amounts of power (if the architect's theories on this holds true) with a footprint not much bigger than a typical windmill. Maybe replace a few dozen windmills with a single "turbine only" tower like that. Not only that, but following the claims, it would spin regardless of where the wind was coming from, no need to have the unit turn like a windmill.

But when all is said and done, it's 2007 and I believe we were all promised hovercars a loooooong time agao.

I love IT.
Like to Move in BUT Id face these issues:

o Rapid escape in case of Fire.
o Having Ext skin Rotate with Blades vs whole Units.
o Having floors rotate out for More Ext Fan Blade rotation.
o Need multiple elevators or Star Trek Turbolift system for acess.
o Need Rapid escape due to Fire:
1974 movie Towering Inferno & 9-11.

But having bldgs rotate to the wind Is long overdue.
Problem:
Motion sickness due to spinning floors or Views outside.
Otherwise Fine.

Must address Upper Floors Escape.
IE:
Lifepods with parachute
LifeBalls: hold 20 persons & Ball drops BUT bounces
& stops for escape???
etc.

Can use Heliport Center too.
& Observation Dining space.

Otherwise Im in:
For these locales:
Honolulu HI
Kona HI
Cancun Mex
Miami FL
Tampa FL
Atlanta GA
Denver CO
Chicago
NYC LI
Boston
Va Bch VA
Columbia SC
Albq NM
Tuscon AZ
El Paso TX
St Louis MO
Veracruz Mex
Rio, Brazil.
Athens
Sydney
Perth
Java
Manila
Kobe Japan.

Have 1 tower power 20???
WindTower wind farms with estd wind farms.
More Power.

fcuking retarded. you would waste more money in design, construction and maintenance alone than you would ever save in energy. build a fckuing windfarm stupid.

In Poland we have "Dom do góry nogami" when the roof is on the ground. For sure it doesn`t save energy. Just idea how to get tourists. (no comments.)

look at this: http://expresskaszubski.pl/akt...po-suficie

The floors would rotate not "spin". This way everyone would get a view of the entire area and you could stop your floor from rotating if you like. The only parts that do spin are the turbines. The real problem I see with this is spinning turbines make a considerable noise. This is really not a practical design but made to order for some showoff sheiks to draw in tourist dollars.

Oh, and let's not forget that too many of these towers would create a gyroscopic drag on the rotation of the earth. Days would become longer and the north and south pole, and seasons would be meaningless... Worldwide chaos would ensue, governments struggling to reestablish the daylight saving's time system, toilets in the southern hemisphere would start to flush clockwise, down would be up, owls exploding everywhere....

And I like owls, too..

Unless we were to build clockwise and counter-clockwise rotating buildings in equal numbers. (Yeah, I'm bored, I had to reply to myself.)

I think it is a great idea to conserve energy. I am 13 and we are working on aproject where we have to create an energy efficient house. I also like the idea for a rotating skyscraper but I don't think every FLOOR has to rotate. The roatating really isn't necessary. I still like the idea, though.

Ironically Bill O'Really plans to host his new show, "No Spin Zone; Dubai Edition" from the new building. (He had to follow his masters to their new headquarters anyway.)

Oh and good one, Dave, May 14, 2007, too funny!

Damn... I guess I need to hire new writers -- I thought the 'exploding owls' was a winner.

Wow, looks like the built a giant dildo for Paris Hilton! but will it satisfy her?

because they did not come up with the idea or are not actually trying it....so WONDERFUL to hear that someone had the guts to design it, and Dubai had the guts to build it.
Everyone hated the Eiffel Tower when it was first built...and the rest is history....

The floors on this would rotate at about the same speed as the Space Needle in Seattle, or other rotating structures. The Space Needle has been there for more than 40 years, hasn't worn out yet. And the diners in the restaurant don't seem to lose much food off their plates.

If their is a problem in the core, the floors could be aligned to become a "staircase" of sorts on its own. People could in an emergency jump from floor to floor. (obviously design tweaks at the edges, such as adding an intermediate step could be used to improve the practicality of it)

In fact, a terraced wall on one wall of each floor could be designed to create a staircase of normal proportion.

I think the best way to do it would be to have the building drill itself into the sand and people can jump off once they're at ground level.

That or just have emergency ladders in the floor of each level that when activated, stop the turbine below it, locking it in place, and the ladder would drop down allowing people to climb down to the floor below. There could be a pulley and basket for the handicapped, and a ......

Or better yet, the turbines could spin fast enough to lift each level off the platform, reverse helicopter-style, flying each level to safety in a nearby lake or river in case it's on fire....

hmmm, how about a waterslide?

Or how about we wait till it's built and see what they did?

Fantastic idea. Lets build it

im curious....

having fast rotating generators the entire length of the building would cause a large gyroscpic effect on the central core.

my betting is this guy has stumbled on a new method of making taller buildings more stable. By using a gyroscopic force around the core the forces would always be nearly completely balanced out. also with the turbines moving, there is going to be much less stress on the building as there is a smaller area for wind resistance to cause problems.
if the floor where made like flying saucers then this would cut drag and enhance the capture of the wind into the turbines.

I think people need to look outside the box and realise there are still things about building design we are yet to learn, i bet having effectively gyroscopes balancing the sway on a tower is going to be so much more stable than current methods.

a small gyroscopic force from your own leg power keeps a bike upright, and when wheelieng a motorcycle if the front wheel is spinning fastly the bike will be more enclined to stay in the wheelie.

dam... i want to copyright the gyroscope idea if it hasnt already been done LOL

I think this is a ridiculous idea, it just makes too many problems, the whole issue of exits, pipes how are they going to get pipes in if your room is moving all the time? all of your stuff will be falling all over the gaff and the turbines would make alot of noise aswell, i seriously could go on for hours with theses sort of flaws but i couldnt be arsed, i think it is a crap idea

Revolving buildings have been around for decades, this isn't a new thing, it just hasn't been done on this scale before. As for motion sickness, the movement would be so slow it would be unnoticeable.

Anyone ever been to a revolving restaurant???? This isn't that radical.

But I do think theres far too much glass on it to be a very energy efficiant building. In Melbourne theres CH2 which is supposed to be the most green building in the world!

http://www.melbourne.vic.gov.au/info.cfm?top=171&pg=1933

Ugh, those last two posts....

I'm reminded of the concept that The people who say something can't be done are usually the only thing blocking the ones actually doing it... It could be a gorgeous, non-moving tower, the specs of your dreams, and still there's going to be that one guy saying "Nahhh... that color will never work in the desert.

Floor spin: Very Slow
Stuff falling off the gaff: Not going to happen

Pipes: Good point, but nature gets water from place to place without copper pipe, we can too. Maybe they could have reservoirs on each floor, inlet to such doesn't rotate, but the outlet rotates with the sink and tub?

Whatever the case, They're not going to build a tower in a desert without some route to water, right?

As for the noise the turbines would make? Probably masked for most part, and the vibration it would cause would be noticeable at first, but you'd get used to it.

Getting to the "Far too much glass" statement, assumably to mask that sound, yes, it'll need to be thick, but if it's well-balanced, it won't effect it's ability to spin, just how much energy is required to get it accelerated to a start or stop. Looks like the blades would rotate in the same direction as the floors, that would make it a little easier to get them moving... Again, we'll have to see what it looks like once it's built.

All things considered, it's a great idea to get attention, but it's a little @*&$^ing goofy, if you ask me.

to discover the limits of the possible, one should venture a little way past them and into the impossible.
-- Sir Arthur C. Clark

I wish more architects and clients would push the bill.

this fuck momument this is mada kucka house popierdoleni ahhaah

I like it.

But I think it should be designed where the floors had a narrow edge and a wide edge, somewhat football shaped.

That way, in the winter, the wide edge could face the sun and pick up solar heat gain. In the summer, the narrow edge would face the sun, thus minimizing the gain.

The savings in space heating and cooling, as well as the energy generated by the turbines, really could make these towers revolutionary if the mechanicals could all be worked out.

I say hire a handful of damned good engineers and keep on keepin on.

If this idea works out....
Technically, it is going to be one of the best buildings mankind ever achieved....

If it doesnt work out....
lets learn from its failures and correct them in our future projects (if u desire to build one).

For, the path is being laid...
we are standing before our future....
i guess we know wat to do.

http://www.dynamicarchitecture.net/

For the doubters who think the rotation of the floors is just too much energy for the wind turbines. This is revolutionary in every way and a HUGE stepping stone in artchitecture, one I would love to be a hope/resident of one day!

The building is much cheaper to build than standard buildings now, takes much less time and only needs 90 workers on site to complete, compared to the standard 2000.

Honestly, do you really not think they would inquire about future maintence issues when building it? David Fisher is the designer and I can assure you he and the designers have engineered a plan to insure the wind turbines longevity. You don't build a car that can't open up it's hood to the engine, so why on earth do you think they would do that with this incredible piece of architecture?

I think the revolutions and its effect on the human body are underestimated. Like testing for a space craft, people should build a model and test how people actually live in such a space because hypothesis can only do so much.

Vertigo is felt by a lot of people on a daily basis even when they are just walking or sitting still. Imagine how it would effect people to be in this environment.

It seems the prerequisites of actually living in these buildings would be that one needs to be of good health and not have multiple sclerosis, syphilis, tumors, vertigo and other neurological or physical ailments that affect one's perception of balance. If you were sick would you get better by home stay? Also what about people who have pets? How would they react? Perhaps this building would have to be a pet free zone.

Maybe there needs to be a pharmacy that doles out
Dramamine, Bonine and Marezine on every floor.

I suppose the contract should state that once the occupant has reached a certain age (old age) they will have to give up their residency and move out, as the sickness, aging and disease that come with old age would certainly only be aggravated by the movements of this building.

You can't spend the rest if your life here.

i would like to see the inner layout - the floor plan of this thing.

here http://www.dynamicarchitecture...ATION.html

or here http://www.dynamicarchitecture.net/home.html

:-

All negative comments about something different being created are the same like comments people had about airplanes, passengers flying in an airplanes. I have invented a innovative medical device that is different compared to any medical device in visual healthcare and thats why its called an invention!

The stupid idea was electing Bush into office .... What in the fuck were you thinking? Invading Iraq has cost aqlmost 1 Trillion dollars and Halliburton got half of that by way of no bid contracts!

im majoring in architectural drafting and design and i was wondering how the plumbing system would work while the floors are rotating

Hi Guys
I have few quiries about earth quakes and effects of dust storm in dubai. I know that there are chances of dust storms,If the sand starts piling in
between floors it would be necessary for some sort of cleaning mechanism should be present , What if there is a huge earth quake then no idea, and checking the palm beaches if there is a hurricane i dont know how dangerous it would be stay in those places , hope they are far away from any Tsunami,

It seems like a nice idea, but it is hardly practical. Let's forget silly little things like safety for a minute. This would be horribly expensive and a maintenance nightmare. Then you have the issue of the rotating floor and navigating the building. It seems neat, but simple things like wind turbines, solar panels and conservation would probably prove more effective.

hi can i know which type of foundation will be used and what will be its depth...

How fast does this thing turn? I am getting dizzy just thinking about it. I'm not sure how productive I would be able to be in my office if I was spinning around.. maybe they could plant this thing under ground and channel the energy differently..
-Sylvia

hi frients...........have a good life to all of my soul in the world...
after seeing this wonderfull 8 wonder ,just now am thinking those guys who design can have the ability to create the another world

How about mechanicals? Water?