Comments for Horrendous Journalism: Scooters Pollute More than Hummers?!?!? at http://ecogeek.org , comment 1 to 18 out of 18 comments http://ecogeek.org Sat, 18 May 2013 14:59:15 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-27437 I really appreciate your blog.well done. - Mathew Fri, 05 Jun 2009 03:54:09 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26292 did anybody ever settle on a definition for pollution? seriously! - L Sat, 25 Apr 2009 07:18:07 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26285 Happy Earth-Minute, Hank and Everyone...hmmm leaf-blowers...ask the Permaculture people about lawns?...scooters are closer to my heart as I once worshipped the Lambretta 175...I had to settle for a used 4-stroke Triumph 200cc. I still feel a bit safer on a "motorcycle". The oil-mixed 2-stroke is a sad thing indeed. Even so, a major reduction in overall petroleum consumption must remain high priority. There are several REALLY COOL pedal/electric bicycles available...plug-in at work or overnight. The observation that a NEW water-cooled 4-stroke (Hummer?? OK, I guess...)pollutes less than an ancient Yamaha or a Sears weedeater is hard to argue with. Sadly, many of us know that working folks try to squeeze 2 or 3 HUNDRED THOUSAND miles out of their cars and trucks...in Japan many motors with more than 50K Km on them must be rebuilt, or even better, dismantled and shipped to the USA as "rebuilt". I agree with the crowd here: The bicycle is tops; electric bikes and scooters go farther faster; 4-strokes are much cleaner...the smoggers must be recycled... - Dan Grinde Sat, 25 Apr 2009 00:45:22 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26182 What funny people you are. How can so many read an article and yet not understand it? Too many of you seem to be stuck on the [i]"yeah-it's-dirtier-but-the-engine-is-teeny-weeny-compared-to-the-engine-of-a-big-bad-Hummer"[/i] notion. Steve A gets it, and it's not about engine size. The SIMPLE fact is this(Sorry for the shouting but I feel the need!): IF YOU RUN A 2-STROKE ENGINE and A HUMMER ENGINE FOR A MINUTE, THE 2-STROKE WILL EMIT FAR, FAR, FAR, FAR, [b]FAAAAAAR[/b] MORE POLLUTANTS (esp. toxic ones) THAN THE HUMMER! It's not 'proportional', it's ACTUAL! As Steve A. quoted: [quote]"The average hydrocarbon emission of a 2-stroke, per mile, is 10-22 times higher than an SUV."[/quote]. I'm an ex (classic) Vespa owner, and I LOVE them. But I wouldn't ride anything but a 4-stroke from now on. m@ (1) Footnote: Europe apparently IS the biggest market for Scooters (for now). Asia has more motorcycles and mo-peds. (2) Leaf-blowers are one of my most hated devices ever. they're noisy, VERY polluting and they don't work well anyway. USE A BLOODY BROOM AND A RAKE AMERICA! (Yes, we have them here too but it's America which is in love with the lazy, inefficient decadence of the leaf-blower so I'm blaming YOU! ;-) ) - matt kennedy Tue, 21 Apr 2009 18:51:02 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26131 It seems to me that 2 stroke scooters still easily number out 4 stroke models here in Holland. As a cyclist every encouter with a 2 stroke monster is one to many. Besides their high pollution they also excel in very disturbing noise and a long lasting odour nuisance.. I wish those evil creations will be forbidden globally asap - edgerunner Mon, 20 Apr 2009 06:09:45 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26017 Wow. Just got rid of that two-stroke ET2. Lovin' the GTS 250! - ABQ Bear Tue, 14 Apr 2009 13:07:22 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26011 Do you mean "extent" rather than "extend"? You could at least bother to be precise if you're going to incite a flame war for no reason other than to garner page hits. - Zaharastra Tue, 14 Apr 2009 09:25:49 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26004 This blog's horrendous journalism should be fixed before criticizing others. - Gregory Tue, 14 Apr 2009 07:26:24 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-26001 By linking the article, you just increase Google's Page-rank of that page. However, by pointing to this issue, people my start demanding cleaner scooters. And guess what, I bet the electric scooters, by the way already in market, will be first to start the inevitable electric-powered commuting revolution. Is Europe really the largest scooter market? I beg to differ as I believe the triumph belongs to Asia. - Funtomas Tue, 14 Apr 2009 06:41:07 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25995 While they may not pollute as much as a hummer, I am still curious as to how much they pollute. Are they still an environmental choice? - Mark Haines Tue, 14 Apr 2009 00:18:10 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25983 the answer is electric scooters! - Jay Tee Mon, 13 Apr 2009 18:12:03 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25970 Bill, In one of the more recent Bill Nye's 'Stuff Happens' episodes on Planet Green, he states that using a 2-stroke leaf blower for 30 minutes "pollutes as much as driving a car for 2200 miles." A typical 2-stroke dumps as much as 30% of their fuel/oil out the tailpipe, unburned. Where a modern car has a fairly clean burning system of electronic ignition, emissions controls, timing controls and a catalytic converter. Total CO2 per mile driven may be in the 2-stroke scooter's favor, however the other, more directly hazardous to human health emissions are vastly higher. The average hydrocarbon emission of a 2-stroke, per mile, is 10-22 times higher than an SUV. - Steve A. Mon, 13 Apr 2009 13:08:14 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25969 Yes, 2-stroke pollution is bad, and there are still many 2-stroke scooters for sale (although in the significant minority of scooters now days). But there is a big difference that everyone forgets about...the quantity of exhaust gases. That huge displacement V-8 makes a lot more "clean" exhaust than the relatively small amount of dirty 2-stroke smoke. I don't claim to know how they compare in real life though. Also, the quantity of exhaust used by scooters is probably minuscule compared to all the 2-stroke lawn equipment out there. - Bill Mon, 13 Apr 2009 12:36:52 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25966 [i]"Go to your local scooter dealer, see if you can find a single 2-stroke scooter on the lot. Excluding mo-peds, you'll be out of luck."[/i] Not quite. My local Ducati Dealer sells 'Genuine Scooter Company' Scooters, including their 'Stella' model. They are 150cc 2-stroke scooters and are available in every state except CA. My wife owns a 2006 model, and it's quite fun and has a top speed of 60+ mph. But yes, it is very, very bad for the environment. http://www.genuinescooters.com/scooters/stella/stella.html - Steve A. Mon, 13 Apr 2009 10:32:59 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25963 This is just like the time two intrepid Washington Post journalists uncovered the Watergate Scandal. Except I couldn't care less. - Yael Mon, 13 Apr 2009 08:39:21 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25958 I think this is just an example of sensationalized journalism, where journalists go for "shocking headlines" without really checking the facts. What a shame. - N. Mon, 13 Apr 2009 00:11:57 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25950 Scooters will pollute less than a Hummer both since the fuel used per mile is less, and since a driver of a scooter is less likely to use their vehicle to travel as far. Scooters also require far less material resources during manufacture than a Hummer. Of course four people traveling to a destination will need 2 scooters compared to a single Hummer - or perhaps they might choose some form of public transportation... Additionally if a city were to plan for smaller vehicles such as scooters and compact cars in mind rather than providing massive parking spaces and lots for over-sized vehicles the result will be more compact, more efficient, more transit oriented, and less polluting cities. - j1mmyc_ Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:25:32 +0100 http://ecogeek.org/automobiles/2682#comment-25949 2 strokes are worse than four strokes, but small 4 cycle engines are very primitive and most scooters lack catalytic converters and other pollution equipment (same for lawn mowers and other small enginers). The EPA is starting to regulate, but the time scale is long. I would assume most scooters would be worse than the worst cars in most pollutants other than carbon dioxide (which will be proportional to the amount of gas burned) http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.nsf/6424ac1caa800aab85257359003f5337/0cb7669b182b145d852572c0005e415a!OpenDocument - steve Sun, 12 Apr 2009 15:28:41 +0100