For the (one or two) LA drivers of hydrogen-powered vehicles, there will be a filling station on Santa Monica Boulevard to accommodate you starting later in June, and several more LA-based stations in the next few months.
Creating the hydrogen with an electrolyzer from electricity on site, the station will be part of a research program run by US Department of Energy in conjunction with Shell and GM. Shell will build a few more stations on its own in the next few months, and they will be part of “mini networks” of hydrogen filling stations that will hopefully help spark mass production of fuel cell vehicles. These are needed in big cities since the only emission would be water, but paradoxically, the source for the hydrogen is fossil fuels. For now, anyway.
Shell is making a big step forward in this process because it is working with electrolyzers running off wind power (in the Netherlands) and geothermal power (in Iceland), but these types of sources don’t create enough hydrogen to support the huge number of LA drivers who would be buying these some-day-mass-produced fuel cell vehicles. So, yet again, no silver bullet is in sight. Rather, a compromise is made. At least they recognize this is a short term solution. Other solutions in the works include carbon capture and storage, bio-feedstocks and municipal solid waste.
Hydrogen fueling stations are being tested in other parts of the world, and we'll be able watch these and Shell to see how to progress.
Via cnet
Photo via Tortuga One
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written by Caroline Streich, June 04, 2008
It's a step towards a solution! It still amazes me that Iceland, a country with barley 300,000 citizens, can be so advance, they have had a hydrogen filling station for at least 3 years! So even if this is a step what took so long?
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written by GeekinTexas, June 04, 2008
Iceland has ginormous amounts of geothermal energy available. They don't need to heat water to make hot water, it comes right out of the ground. Hot springs are abundant, and they use a lot of their extra energy to convert water to hydrogen (and oxygen) and even smelt aluminum for other countries. I've read (take this with a grain of salt) that their only uses of fossil fuel are for airplanes and ships.
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written by Carter L, June 04, 2008
Caroline,
Iceland is a small island nation that is pretty much a city-state. It also has a lot of renewable energy in the form of geothermal energy. Through using the excess geothermal energy, Iceland can refine hydrogen and send it to a few fueling stations to power a hydrogen vehicle fleet. As it is such a small country, it does not require that much infrastructure (which is the biggest issue in establishing a Hydrogen Economy). Also as it has excess renewable energy, Iceland's hydrogen is carbon neutral. However, as the US electrical grid is dominated by coal, and not renewables, refining hydrogen through electrolysis will result in a lot of carbon dioxide (and other pollutants) being emitted. Hydrogen is not a solution to the energy crisis as it is an way of storing energy, not producing it. Just remember, hydrogen is only as clean as the grid.
Iceland is a small island nation that is pretty much a city-state. It also has a lot of renewable energy in the form of geothermal energy. Through using the excess geothermal energy, Iceland can refine hydrogen and send it to a few fueling stations to power a hydrogen vehicle fleet. As it is such a small country, it does not require that much infrastructure (which is the biggest issue in establishing a Hydrogen Economy). Also as it has excess renewable energy, Iceland's hydrogen is carbon neutral. However, as the US electrical grid is dominated by coal, and not renewables, refining hydrogen through electrolysis will result in a lot of carbon dioxide (and other pollutants) being emitted. Hydrogen is not a solution to the energy crisis as it is an way of storing energy, not producing it. Just remember, hydrogen is only as clean as the grid.
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written by Bob Wallace, June 04, 2008
Iceland also has a lot of hydro power.
The rest of the world is unlikely to imitate Iceland.
The rest of the world is unlikely to imitate Iceland.
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written by skierpage, June 04, 2008
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_cell_vehicle Wikipedia:
A hydrogen tank fuel cell might weigh less than batteries. A hydrogen fill-up is faster than recharging batteries. That's it for the advantages of hydrogen.
A hydrogen tank fuel cell might weigh less than batteries. A hydrogen fill-up is faster than recharging batteries. That's it for the advantages of hydrogen.
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written by paolo, June 05, 2008
yep. the diagram says it all.
...i'll be filling my car with all that lovely WASTEFUL (2 barrels oil = 1 barrel hydrogen), expensive, explosive hydrogen,,, mmm yes please.
Big oil can go to hell with all this sci fi hydrogen crap.
They're just running scared of battery electric cars that can be 'filled up' for pennies from green power, or, god forbid, for FREE from your own solar panels,,,, and they are going to great and wasteful lengths to make sure you keep buying product, any product.
Well Screw You, Big Oil. Screw your "one day in the future" Hydrogen.
Where's my electric car, mofos?
...i'll be filling my car with all that lovely WASTEFUL (2 barrels oil = 1 barrel hydrogen), expensive, explosive hydrogen,,, mmm yes please.
Big oil can go to hell with all this sci fi hydrogen crap.
They're just running scared of battery electric cars that can be 'filled up' for pennies from green power, or, god forbid, for FREE from your own solar panels,,,, and they are going to great and wasteful lengths to make sure you keep buying product, any product.
Well Screw You, Big Oil. Screw your "one day in the future" Hydrogen.
Where's my electric car, mofos?
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written by Sigurjón Halldórsson Birnuson, June 05, 2008
Electric cars are coming. The number of available models will multiply within the next few years, in particular if oil prices stay high. I agree that the hydrogen hype is "stupid".
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written by EV, June 05, 2008
A hydrogen tank fuel cell might weigh less than batteries. A hydrogen fill-up is faster than recharging batteries. That's it for the advantages of hydrogen.
Don't underestimate the importance of the second advantage you list.
Paolo, Big Oil is not scared of Electric Vehicles or Hydrogen Cars. Oil will still be in use in some way, even if it is not as a fuel.
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written by Charles, June 05, 2008
Inefficient, maybe, but the manufacturers must be able to convince the general populace to buy them, or they simply won't be made. A lighter, faster-charging car is going to appeal a good deal more to consumers than something they have to charge overnight every day.
Also, assuming that the power comes from a renewable source (and, lets face it, if it doesn't you're wasting your time with a fuel-cell driven car anyway), wasting power doesn't really do any harm.
Also, assuming that the power comes from a renewable source (and, lets face it, if it doesn't you're wasting your time with a fuel-cell driven car anyway), wasting power doesn't really do any harm.
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written by Max, June 05, 2008
We should use the very clean power provided by nuclear power plants. We have thousands of square miles of federally owned land where they could be built away from any population centers. The nuclear waste could be buried in the middle of the unpopulated desert. These plants can provide us cleaner power to fuel our electric & hydrogen cars until solar & wind technologies advance enough to become a viable alternative for the mass market. It's sure cheaper than being in perma-war in the middle east for generations to come.
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written by jon, June 05, 2008
We don't need more power...we need to consume less 8)
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written by Chuck, June 05, 2008
Didn't they say they produce hydrogen from electrolysis? If that is correct, then the hydrogen on demand technology must be genuine right? Besides, Ron motors of Austin Texas are going to put some hydrogen on demand cars in the market in October and these cars won't need hydrogen stations! :)
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written by Christopher Keys, June 05, 2008
This is the headline that seems to be the game changer: Air-Powered Car Coming to U.S. in 2009 to 2010 at Sub-$18,000, Could Hit 1000-Mile Range. With a car that can run on air, using other fuel sources for city transport seem a bit tired.
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written by You First!, June 05, 2008
How about you first. Get off the Internet and stop using so much power!
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written by firefox user, June 05, 2008
Thought you might like to know.
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written by Digital, June 06, 2008
I can't believe how many spelling errors are in this report. While interesting and somewhat informative, perhaps a proof read and spell check is in order.
P.S.- Yes, I'm THAT guy.
P.S.- Yes, I'm THAT guy.
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written by paolo, June 06, 2008
Max, can we bury that very safe nuclear waste in your backyard? it should be ok in about mm, 100,000 years.... ok? that's great, thanks.
Big Oil is the Author of the Myth of Hydrogen Cars, EV. We will all be living in geodesic domes on the moon before we are driving Hydrogen Cars....
And of course Big Oil aren't afraid of Battery Electric Cars,,,, They're the ones who killed them, aren't they?
and might I add, SCREW YOU Big Oil.
Big Oil is the Author of the Myth of Hydrogen Cars, EV. We will all be living in geodesic domes on the moon before we are driving Hydrogen Cars....
And of course Big Oil aren't afraid of Battery Electric Cars,,,, They're the ones who killed them, aren't they?
and might I add, SCREW YOU Big Oil.
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written by owen, June 06, 2008
Another benefit of hydrogen is that it stores energy at 100% efficience (once actually harvested and compressed) without the use of toxic batteries with limited lifespans. As long as a green energy infrastructure is in place to make the hydrogen i see it as a superior option.
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written by paolo, June 06, 2008
owen, that's bull.
If you'll cast your eye upwards to the little chart, you'll see that the Almighty Hydrogen is actually about 25% efficient.
New lithium batteries are completely recyclable, and non-toxic.
Limited lifespan? Once you burn hydrogen it's GONE. How's that for a limited lifespan?
If you'll cast your eye upwards to the little chart, you'll see that the Almighty Hydrogen is actually about 25% efficient.
New lithium batteries are completely recyclable, and non-toxic.
Limited lifespan? Once you burn hydrogen it's GONE. How's that for a limited lifespan?
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written by Marie, June 12, 2008
I'd just like to point out that even though hydrogen may not be as efficient as electric cars it is better than regular gas. Atleast Shell is trying to take a step forward. Seeing as the only waste product is water... I'd say its a good start. Electric cars are great don't get me wrong, but atleast hydrogen will make a difference in the amount of pollution we create. (even though its made from oil)
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written by dr d, October 15, 2008
paolo, you belieive every little chart you see? Hydrogens efficency can increasingly improve as technology improves. It was also years in the making to create a battery that could power a car.
Also, when it comes to using just WATER for Hydrogen, or paying for electricity to power your vehicle using what amounts to a lot of coal burned energy to charge, its clear that you're dead wrong and so is that chart.
There are already cars that have their own hydrogen generators, a switch that you turn on that starts the process, creating enough hydrogen in the injectors to start the vehicle, all from h2o in the tank - no gas even to start it.
Hydrogen fueling at Shell? Wow... So people really think they will need that? I'd rather get a hydrogen conversion kit and use WATER instead of buying someone elses produced Hydrogen.
Also, when it comes to using just WATER for Hydrogen, or paying for electricity to power your vehicle using what amounts to a lot of coal burned energy to charge, its clear that you're dead wrong and so is that chart.
There are already cars that have their own hydrogen generators, a switch that you turn on that starts the process, creating enough hydrogen in the injectors to start the vehicle, all from h2o in the tank - no gas even to start it.
Hydrogen fueling at Shell? Wow... So people really think they will need that? I'd rather get a hydrogen conversion kit and use WATER instead of buying someone elses produced Hydrogen.
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